mini ITX decisions...

I'm looking to make my unraid box smaller, I simply do not need the large case motherboard I have.

I've researched ITX boards and have narrowed it down to the ASRock AD2550R (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157417) or Asus H87I-PLUS (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813132032) that Gary loves so much!

Given the difference in platforms (CPU, Memory) I've done a cost analysis and using a Celeron G1820 and the cheapest available 4gigs of dual-channel ram I could find the cost difference is literally a penny. Go figure.

So which would you choose? Why?

Usage scenario is simply unraid vanilla, no docker, VM, and only administrative level plugins for things like UPS, Powerdown, unMenu, etc. I use a dedicated Asus EeeBox PC running Ubuntu server for apps like CouchPotato.

I can see the ASRock has 1 additional SATA port (7 vs 6). All 6 ports on the Asus are SATA3 (likely not to make a huge difference on mechanical HDD's anyways).

So, let's here your thoughts!!!

Thanks, Mike

I wouldn't say I'm all that much bound to that board -- I've simply used it on several builds and it's an excellent choice for a Haswell-based solution.

The AsRock Atom board is also very nice ... as long as you're okay with its level of performance, it's an excellent choice.

As for the specifics for what you're looking at ...

The Atom-based AsRock is very nice and has the advantage of an extra SATA port ... but the "horsepower" of that board is quite low -- PassMark is only 666.    The Asus Haswell-based board lets you choose your CPU and will have FAR more power ... the Celeron you listed scores 2773 on PassMark ... and for more $$ you can bump that to whatever performance level you want -- i3's go up to ~ 5000, and i7's go over 10,000.

Having said that, for a basic NAS -- no plugins, no dockers, etc. -- the Atom board is fine.  I'm VERY happy with my D525-based server ... and it only scores 699 on PassMark -- almost identical to what you're looking at with the AsRock board.  I have absolutely no plans to upgrade this -- it works perfectly for what I want (also a basic NAS with only UnMenu, UPS support, and PowerDown, etc.).    And no Haswell-based system will be as low-power as the Atom boards.    My server idles at ~ 20 watts (with drives spun down) ... and only hits ~ 45 watts even during parity checks (with 6 WD Reds).

I went with the Asus H87i-plus, simply because i found one on ebay for $60 off retail that was brand new.

So far I have ordered the following:

Asus H87i-PLUS

Celeron G1840

Cruical 2GB DDR3

Next up, a ITX case that I can hopefully reuse my Corsair HX650 with. I think the Q25 will work as this PSU is only 150mm deep.

I think it's very questionable whether or not the HX650 can be "crammed in" to the Q25B.  Personally, I'd spend a few $$ and get a nice SFX unit like this one:  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817256097

It's a much better fit for this system -- both physically and electrically, since you'll be running well within its 80+ efficiency range most of the time (which is not true with a 650w unit).

But an alternative if you want to use the HX650 is to get Lian-Li's extender, which allows using ATX units and still provides a bit of working room in the case:  http://www.coolerguys.com/llpe01.html

Well, i already have the HX650 so giving it a shot doesnt cost me anything.

Frankly, i'm torn whether to get the extender or SFX power supply (in the event the HX650 doesn't fit as is). The extender is significantly more cost effective, but really detracts from the looks of the Q25 case. I also have no other PC's that need a PSU, nor do I see myself needing one for another PC anytime soon.

My other case choice is the Q08B, using a hot swap dock that I already own in the 5.25 bay for pre-clears. Anyone have experienced with the Q08B??

What other ITX sized cases are good for unraid that can handle a ATX PSU??

I've also used the Q08B case.  It's got pretty close to the same constraints as the Q25B for the power supply -- the specs show 5mm more space with the Q08.    You MAY, in either case, be able to use your HX650 -- but it WILL be a VERY tight fit if it fits at all.

Despite the specs that SAY you can use an ATX power supply with these cases, it's simply NOT a good idea.  I'd either use the extender (which will fit either case); or (a better idea) buy a nice SFX unit.

The Silverstone ST30SF is only $50;  has an efficiency range that starts at only 60 watts (compared to 130 watts for your HX 650); and is a FAR better fit in a mini-ITX case.

Never hurts to have a quality spare PSU available -- I'd just put the HX650 on your shelf and use the Silverstone SFX unit for your new build.    You'd have a much nicer build with either of the Lian-Li cases you're considering.  [The Q25B is a better choice with its hot-swap cages and exceptionally good cooling.]

... a couple other thoughts r.e. the two cases:

The Q08B is a better choice if you're building a mini-ITX workstation, where you need the 5.25" external bay for an optical drive.  But for an UnRAID server, the hot-swap cages in the Q25B, along with the aluminum bottom rack that will hold 2-3 more drives (depending on size) is a better arrangement.

Both are excellent choices, but the Q25B "feels" a bit more solid.

I stumbled upon the q35 on google, but cant seem to find it for sale anywhere...

I stumbled upon the q35 on google, but cant seem to find it for sale anywhere...

Seems to be available here:  http://www.frozencpu.com/products/23134/cst-1495/Lian_Li_PC-Q35_Mini_ITX_DTX_Mini_Tower_Chassis_-_Black_PC-Q35B.html

Looks like it has a few mm more space for the PSU ... but I'd still think it's crowding it to use an ATX supply.  I simply would NOT use an ATX power supply in one of these cases without using the Lian-Li extender.  You seem doubtful --- so just buy the case you want and see IF/how your HX650 fits ... you can always just buy the extender and still use it -- or perhaps you'll agree that a few $$ for a nice SFX unit is a good idea after you see how tight the fit is.

Thanks Gary for the help. I'm sure I'll end up with a SFX unit or the extender, but since I have a running system currently there's no urgency to order all the parts a head of time.

Other options I've toyed with for the case are the DS380, Node 304...

I've become a fan of the fractal node 804.  It's a bigger case but handles 8x3.5 and 4x2.5 drives in a nice tight box.  My storage space means I can handle wider, but not taller cases so this is near perfect.

Fractal does indeed make very nice cases.

But it's hardly surprising that there's more room in a micro-ATX case than a mini-ITX case 

Note that the Node 804 is over twice the size of a PC-Q25B ... 2506 cu.in.  vs.  1243 cu.in

... but it will definitely work nicely with an ATX power supply, which mounts in a completely separate chamber than the motherboard.

I've become a fan of the fractal node 804.  It's a bigger case but handles 8x3.5 and 4x2.5 drives in a nice tight box.  My storage space means I can handle wider, but not taller cases so this is near perfect.

Can't you just lay a "tall" box on its side?

I've become a fan of the fractal node 804.  It's a bigger case but handles 8x3.5 and 4x2.5 drives in a nice tight box.  My storage space means I can handle wider, but not taller cases so this is near perfect.

 

Can't you just lay a "tall" box on its side?

Not necessarily a good idea, as the airflow won't then match the design of the case (i.e. a top fan will now be a side fan, etc.).

Mike:  ... by the way, if you decide to use a micro-ATX case, I'd look carefully at the Fractal Define Mini.  It's not all that "mini", but it's a VERY nice case.  I've used this for a few builds, really like the quality of the build, the excellent airflow, and the very nice sound insulation:  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811352011    It's taller than a Node 804 (~ 5"), but not nearly as wide and the same depth.

...  but FWIW I still think the best choice for what you've outlined is a Q25B with an SFX power supply 

I've become a fan of the fractal node 804.  It's a bigger case but handles 8x3.5 and 4x2.5 drives in a nice tight box.  My storage space means I can handle wider, but not taller cases so this is near perfect.

 

Can't you just lay a "tall" box on its side?

 

Not necessarily a good idea, as the airflow won't then match the design of the case (i.e. a top fan will now be a side fan, etc.).

Good thing a tall case's "side fan" is magically now a "top fan" ;-) .. but don't go reversing the flow or you'll lose the benefit of blowing cool air directly "down" onto the MB.  Despite heat rising, a tower case turned on its side still gets the right airflow with cool air onto the board and hot air exhausted out the back and/or the "side"

That works as long as the case has a side fan -- not all do.  In an UnRAID box where there are likely a fair number of hard drives with a front fan (or fans) blowing air over those drives, you'll get much better heat removal if there's a "top" fan pulling it out.    The air will still be exhausted if that fan is now on the side (i.e. the case is sitting on it's side) ... but it'll be somewhat less efficient.

I agree, however, that it'll still work okay as long as you aren't using a high-end heat-generating graphics card (which is very unlikely with UnRAID).

Hey I didn't say which "tall" case someone should choose to turn on its side.  I left that part of my comment as an exercise for the reader ;-)

re: high end graphics ... well then someone might want to reverse the flow of that side-turned-top fan.

I should have explained myself better.  The space I have to work with is square shaped, so the more cube like, the better.

Gary,can you move this to the hardware forum now? Thanks!

Gary,can you move this to the hardware forum now? Thanks!

Done 

well another Kijiji ad came through with some funds and i purchased a Silverstone SFX power supply. I got the 450w non-modular unit for two reasons.

1. Cost. The modular was $109.99 and the non-modular was only $69.99.

2. Reliability. The modular version is only load rated to 450w @ 40c and has a similar operating temperature range. The non-modular version has its load certified to 50c and a similar operating temperature range to 50c. What this tells me from reading numerous reviews over the past decade is that the non-modular unit has better components inside to allow the higher rating.

The last of the parts arrived today as well and assembly has begun!

I leave you with the required shot of all components in their boxes on a kitchen table!

I leave you with the required shot of all components in their boxes on a kitchen table!

Nah ... doesn't have to be a kitchen table -- any table will do 

By the way, another difference between the modular & non-modular versions of the Silverstone SFX units is that the non-modular has a power switch;  the modular does not.    A major flaw in the modular version IMHO.

I leave you with the required shot of all components in their boxes on a kitchen table!

 

Nah ... doesn't have to be a kitchen table -- any table will do 

 

By the way, another difference between the modular & non-modular versions of the Silverstone SFX units is that the non-modular has a power switch;  the modular does not.    A major flaw in the modular version IMHO.

oh yah that's right too! major oversight on their part.